[Catfish]

Project Jenova is clearly not what it used to be. It's glory days are long past and even 3 years ago this place was still considered slow. The board's rotting and if things continue like this it looks like it'll be a long and slow death unless Night-Red suddenly pulls the plug at some point. At this point, it's hard to tell when that will happen. More importantly, we lack full control to the board. We all still come here, so that shows that this place must have some value and I think that it should be preserved. So, I think we should move over to another forum. Not some side-forum bullshit, but a full replacement so we can go ahead and abandon this place and maybe leave a note for anybody old that wanders back here.

I like this place, but it's not our place, and it doesn't have any direction. There are a lot of dead subforums that need to be gotten rid of and new ones that need to be made. I don't know about the extent of Fred's powers, but there's not really much I can do other than ban people and delete posts/topics. I'm not a real power or authority here, just a janitor trying to keep things open and pretty free. It's pretty frustrating that there's a lot we could do to make this place better but are locked out for the most part, and I think that if we have some greater control over the board it'll be more enjoyable to use and manage. I'm anticipating being hired within the next week, so assuming I'll have income soon I'm willing to host the thing myself and pay all the costs. If anyone wants to split responsibility I'll share the costs or contribute to whoever does host it.

I don't really care who's in charge as long as they're already an active user and are willing to actually run the place.

What are your thoughts? Any takers or nominations?

[Toki]

Parting ways with Jenova is like parting with a piece of myself. I've been here for seven long years, now. I've seen many things that changed the way I looked at the world, here, and it's undeniable that the people I met in my time here changed my life, and heck, even who I am in some way. I've seen some of the dumbest people on Earth blow through here, and I've met some friends I'll never forget, a few I imagine I'll be friends with for years and years to come, and one that became my most cherished friend and I doubt I'll ever lose contact with her all the way to my deathbed. I've gotten friends to join, with mixed results, which brought an even deeper connection to the board. I've lived an outrageous life, and even still some of my most vivid memories are visions of this place. It's really strange to think about how I've changed since I've been on this board. I'm an entirely different person than I was back then. Dave and Fred, you're probably two of the only remaining members that saw me from day 1, and you're right, this place is a shell of what it once was. The powers have all gone from the members. It feels void of structure, void of life. Night-Red, although I do appreciate him keeping this board up, IS too absent, and the power needs to be put into the hands of the members that are actually active.

I have some very fond memories--memories I'll cherish for years to come--from PJ, and it's like saying goodbye to a friend you don't know if you'll ever see again, but you're right. It's time to ship out and set sail for new, cleaner waters. I fully support a move, so long as it's done correctly from the get-go and doesn't become a flopped, lawless board like some of the other replacements. We're going to have to put some team effort into this, and I expect all of us senior members in support to pitch in.

This post has been edited by Toki: 20 February 2010 - 06:20 AM

[Catfish]

Toki, on 20 February 2010 - 06:22 AM, said:

I have some very fond memories--memories I'll cherish for years to come--from PJ, and it's like saying goodbye to a friend you don't know if you'll ever see again

I feel that way too, but this place has been wiped so many times there's barely anything in the archive. Most of what we've got now doesn't have avatars or signatures anyway, so fortunately for us we're not losing very much.

Toki, on 20 February 2010 - 06:22 AM, said:

It's time to ship out and set sail for new, cleaner waters. I fully support a move, so long as it's done correctly from the get-go and doesn't become a flopped, lawless board like some of the other replacements. We're going to have to put some team effort into this, and I expect all of us senior members to pitch in.

I have faith in this forum to make the move and abandon this place, I just hope the only thing keeping us here isn't PJ itself and people will stick to the new forum. That's why if we move I want some community insight on how to set it up so we can transition smoothly into a better forum.

[Toki]

Step one is not to make an annoyingly white board. PJ has traditionally been greys and dark blues, and keeping with this tradition is definitely important. I feel like we need a new name, too. Project Jenova just can't be used if it's not really PJ, you know? The project's over. We need to decide upon the categories and the staff before anything is put together. Let's not try to build it as we go, at least not the mainframe. I think we can work with a similar build with a few tweaks.

A possible idea for the forum category layouts:

>Forum Upkeep (news articles posted directly into this category, not sub-categories)
News, updates, and important staff notices will be posted here.
--Queries and Support
Questions? Problems? You've come to the right place.
--Research and Development
Got an idea to improve the board and need a place to pitch it? Look no further.

>General Discussions (Like here, normal topics go directly into it)
From everyday chatter to philosophical discussions, it all goes here.
--Livin' In A Gamer's Paradise
All things vidjya.
--Creative Media
Movies, music, books, if it's media it's here.
--Tech Talk
Computer issues? Crazy new tech coming out?

>Creation Station
--Literary Lounge
The pen is mightier.
--The Studio
From pencils to photos, if it's art it's here.



I don't think an RP forum is necessary anymore, unless the RP crowd comes to the new board. If they do, then that should be a simple addition. This leaves it with 3 main categories on the main page, making it easy to navigate to where you need to go.

This post has been edited by Toki: 20 February 2010 - 06:12 AM

[Saiklo]

Wouldn't we need something to draw people in? We have had metroid here, but the new board assuming there's going to be one, won't really have much of a click unless it has something that people are interested in.

[Catfish]

I think the board should remain open to new people so that it can continue to live and evolve, but it's primarily our forum so we should have a private forum. The paid members thing is outdated, but I do like having that extra, semi-private lounge for more open and relaxed discussions without letting certain people that ruin conversations in. Merit-based and not based on contributions. But I think it should be specified that its to keep certain people out, not just let a few people in.

I can stand PED and pryex types and new people in the regular forum, but don't think they should be allowed everywhere.

Saiklo, on 20 February 2010 - 07:22 AM, said:

Wouldn't we need something to draw people in? We have had metroid here, but the new board assuming there's going to be one, won't really have much of a click unless it has something that people are interested in.

Given the reception to the last 5 or 6 new people to join, I don't think that's a huge issue. I mean, the forum could be used for something else, but that seems like something to tack on later.

[Phizz]

no one gave a fuck when i tried reviving cmb, doubt it'll happen now

[Gaiajack]

Do we... really need a new forum? I don't see what there is to gain, and if we do move that just raises the possibility of something going wrong and the community being interrupted for a while (problems with the new host, problems with the new site, etc. ...).

The reason the glory days are over is because we're down to something like 10 active members (we used to have something like 30 or 40) and also we've all gotten pretty mellow and we're all more or less into the same things, which means less conflict and consequently less drama. This place is like an apartment living room where we all stumble down from our upstairs bedrooms every morning and listlessly hang out for a while. And the reason is basically because we all like eachother. So I don't think the "glory days" are ever going to come back.

If Night-Red did pull the plug, he'd probably warn us before-hand, and if not someone can make a new forum and we'd all migrate there pretty quickly via people telling other people through IM.

If anyone's got any concrete ideas on the sort of stuff we could do with a new forum, then I'm all ears. Also, one thing I do think we should think about is some sort of way to bring in new active members.

[Catfish]

Phizz, on 20 February 2010 - 09:28 AM, said:

no one gave a fuck when i tried reviving cmb, doubt it'll happen now

No reason not to try again. There was a distinct lack of concentrated effort that time. Even though it was a better forum there wasn't much of a reason to move because most people still hung out here with the history and familiar setting. We just have to migrate together and actively leave this place behind so there's no reason to come back.

Gaiajack, on 20 February 2010 - 09:45 AM, said:

So I don't think the "glory days" are ever going to come back.

If Night-Red did pull the plug, he'd probably warn us before-hand, and if not someone can make a new forum and we'd all migrate there pretty quickly via people telling other people through IM.

The point's not to bring back the glory days, those are long gone and impossible to bring back. The point's simply to pre-empt this place's inevitable closing and move over to a more stable and self-governed board. If migrating is the eventual outcome anyway we're wasting time here on an incomplete and inferior forum.

[Pryex]

What if the new forum was a gamers forum in general?

That would attract a much bigger crowd, and it's a step on from metroid.

I mean yeah, this place may not like me, but I like this place, and I'm probably the last person you'll listen too anyway, but I thought I'd post it for the hell of it.

[Toki]

Not all of us are here for games, though. Hell the only real topic in the game section is the currently playing anyway.

[Neckbeard]

I have to admit, I've always felt like a bit of an outsider around here. Like I never really fit in, so I never really tried to. I just sort of...watched from a distance the six years I've been around /pj/ and, I have to admit, I've enjoyed that time a great deal. You guys here can be the coolest fucking dudes on the face of the earth, or you can unleash a wrath that even God himself would be envious of on people that bother you that float through here. Even that's entertaining as hell to watch unfold.

Having said that, I do think it's a good idea to have a forum that you could all go to and have some means of control over. From what I've seen, NR isn't ever around. Ever. If he is, it's just to update everyone on something that he's been working on and then he's gone again just as quickly as he came. He's never really seemed to care all that much about the community or what they've been up to. To him, the community was just...there. Sort of like I am with the board itself. The majority of the member base of /pj/ is a really intelligent crowd for the most part and I honestly believe that, should you all come together on it, you could create a pretty damn cool place to hang out for a few hours a day.

Anyway, that's just my opinion.

Here's to you, /pj/, and to whatever future you may have left.

[Pryex]

Okay, maybe gaming wasn't such a good idea, but then again, everybody's different in their tastes. What if the forum wasn't just about gaming, what if it was a forum for everything. That would get an even bigger crowd, something we'd need to stay alive.

[Deed]

I've certainly had far more attachment to this place than I probably should have, and a weird relationship with the members here. While I realise that I've barely been a noteworthy player in this place's community, I still sorely miss the days when this place was actually welcoming, and not just some frathouse for everybody who aspires to be cool around this place. If there is a new board, with some sort of new direction, then this would give us an incentive to be more appreciative of new people. If we could be more tolerant of those who we don't initially absolutely identify with, then it'd also give the community some diversity. Hell, I might see about pointing some people to the new board, if there is one, to help to jump-start it.

Either way, the whole concept of this place needs a good rocket up its arse, because for me it's still becoming increasingly stale, and I only really come here out of morbid curiosity and to occasionally vent. I barely even talk to anybody from here now. For once, I actually agree with Pryex in that it'd be a god idea to make the new community a gaming board or something. Needs to be a gaming board with a difference, though. Perhaps even a general entertainment board. But most of all, it should be completely identifiable as a hangout spot instead of "that Zebeth board." People come here to lurk because they've read the comic, and then they're likely turned away by the way that people go on around here, or by how boring the place is now.

[Gaiajack]

Deed, on 20 February 2010 - 07:05 PM, said:

I still sorely miss the days when this place was actually welcoming, and not just some frathouse for everybody who aspires to be cool around this place.

Is that really the impression you get from this place now? Three years ago I would have agreed with you, but nowadays even Dave isn't an elitist shithead.

[KingRidley]

I don't know about a new subject, jenova has always felt like it worked to me. It's not a forum based on any theme anymore, it's just a club for a group of friends to hang out. I've tried finding other forums that emulate the feeling we've got here, never could find another one.

As for moving, I have mixed feelings about that. On the one hand, we'd have more control over the board and its features. Maybe new members, maybe not. It would take a global initiative where everyone left at the same time, but if that happened then it could definitely work.

Not going to get into the other hand. Mostly just worries about patience with certain behaviors of mine in a new ruling structure.

Now though I don't really feel like it's my decision, or that I even really have a right to put forth an opinion about it. I feel like I used to contribute more here, but now I just cling on without adding anything of value, intellectually or socially.

I don't know. Not my decision to make, or to imply otherwise.

[Phizz]

tbh i'm not opposed to the idea but i don't think you could get anything different out of just another forum. you need a hook or attraction or something. though you could take a page out of another website and set up an imageboard for pj

[BlackFlame]

I feel like I shouldn't input anything in here yet since I'm really undecided about this.

A complete overhaul of PJ would be a great change for everyone, would give us an opportunity to interact better and feel like a close-knit community, and might even encourage us to build the forum up and bring in new members. On the other hand, we've tried this before. Crashmybrow and that faux-PJ we had on Penguin's server are two primary examples of this, everyone was drawn to them and there was a little bit of discussion here and there, but something would go wrong and everyone ended up flocking back to PJ. I'm not saying a new forum is inevitably going to suck, but it certainly will without extensive planning and preparation.

I've been here for about 8 years, and I've grown through the more interesting stages of my life hanging out on this forum from time to time. I know I really haven't been as active as I used to be, but if everyone is serious about this change I would love to help out in whatever way I can and make this one of the best decisions this board has seen since it started.

[Catfish]

Poll added. This isn't a vote of course, just seeing how people feel.

[Whitezero]

I may be repeating what everyone has said, but I want to hit it off.

I agree, Project Jenova is now just a husk left behind by its former self. The glory days were the best days. I found the forum in late 2004 and lurked around and around as a guest until I finally joined the forum in August of 2006. I was a faggy 12-year-old who didn't learn his place, but I liked the forum. I always read the sprite comics back when there was an abundance of them, I even made sprite comics myself. Sure, I absolutely sucked at making them, but I felt like I wanted to belong. I wanted to be with the crowd. But when the comic started dying down and I realized that I sucked at making comics and people didn't like reading mine, I stopped producing them and let the few good people make their comics. I enjoyed what was left of there, but I decided to move to the general discussions board and I felt like I just joined the forum and quickly made myself look like a faggot. I stopped posting more and decided to lurk more if I want to post like an intelligent person. I am now 16 and even now, I rarely post because I fear I'll make myself look like PED or Pryex.

I feel that we should move into a completely new forum. I feel that a clean slate is necessary not only for me, but for all of us. If we stay here for long ass while, I feel that we will never move on from pj's past and make a new place for us to enjoy.

We could leave Project Jenova to a new generation(if that ever happens) and let them form their glory days and we can finally move on.

So Dave, I will be waiting for this movement with patience.

tl;dr: I support moving into a completely new forum